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Greek Government Press Briefing, 03-03-03

Greek Government Press Briefings in ASCII Greek Directory - Previous Article - Next Article

From: The Hellenic Ministry of Press & Mass Media <http://www.minpress.gr/>

YPOYRGEIO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS

Aqhna, 3 Martioy 2003

H ENHMERWSH TWN POLITIKWN SYNTAKTWN KAI TWN ANTAPOKRITWN

JENOY TYPOY APO TON YPOYRGO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS

KAI KYBERNHTIKO EKPROSWPO XRHSTO PRWTOPAPA

Geia sas kai kalh ebdomada.

Qa hqela na sas enhmerwsw gia to programma toy Prwqypoyrgoy.

Ayrio, stis 10 to prwi, o Prwqypoyrgos, opws gnwrizete, qa metabei sthn Alejandroypolh, opoy qa egkainiasei epishmws to neo nosokomeio ths polhs. Sth synexeia, qa pragmatopoihsei kai kapoies alles epafes.

Thn Tetarth, stis 10 to prwi, qa exei synanthsh me toys ypoyrgoys Oikonomikwn kai Oikonomias Niko Xristodoylakh, Ergasias kai Koinwnikwn Asfalisewn Dhmhtrh Reppa, Anaptyjhs Akh Tsoxatzopoylo kai ton ypoyrgo anaplhrwth Ejwterikwn Taso Giannitsh. Antikeimeno ths syzhthshs qa einai oi politikes ths Lissabonas gia thn proetoimasia ths Ellhnikhs Proedrias enocei kai ths Synodoy Koryfhs twn Bryjellwn. Stis 12.30, qa exei synanthsh me ton ypoyrgo Ejwterikwn Giwrgo Papandreoy kai ton anaplhrwth ypoyrgo Taso Giannitsh.

Thn Pempth, stis 11.30 to prwi, qa exei synanthsh me ton Proedro ths Kypriakhs Dhmokratias Taso Papadopoylo.

Thn Paraskeyh, stis 10 to prwi, qa exei synanthsh me ton ypoyrgo Paideias Petro Eyqymioy. Stis 12 to meshmeri, qa milhsei se ekdhlwsh twn eyrwpaikwn syndikatwn, ston Astera, gyrw apo ta qemata ths apasxolhshs sthn Eyrwph kai thn politikh ths Lissabonas.

Parakalw, tis erwthseis sas.

POYLIDOY: Mia dieykrinistikh erwthsh. Sth synanthsh toy Prwqypoyrgoy me ton k. Papandreoy qa einai kai o k. Kathforhs kai poia qa einai ta qemata;

PRWTOPAPAS: Gnwrizw oti qa einai o ypoyrgos Ejwterikwn G. Papandreoy kai o ypoyrgos anaplhrwths T. Giannitshs. H syzhthsh qa einai ef@ olhs ths ylhs gia qemata ejwterikhs politikhs. Dhladh, exei na kanei me to synolo twn qematwn poy apasxoloyn to ypoyrgeio Ejwterikwn.

IWANNOY: Apo to prwi, oloi oi staqmoi asxoloyntai me to qema ths dikhs, h opoia jekinhse. Epeidh exei ginei polys qorybos apo to prwi kai malista akoysame kai ton k. Sompolo oti, an telika o Proedros toy dikasthrioy apofasisei alliws, endexomenws na yparxei kai kapoia antidrash apo thn ESHEA, qa hqela na rwthsw, gi@ ayto to qema me to koyboyklio. Poios eftiaje kai poios ryqmise xwrotajika thn aiqoysa;

PRWTOPAPAS: H kataskeyastikh etairia "QEMIS" ekane tis metatropes kai th diarryqmish. Einai etairia toy ypoyrgeioy Dikaiosynhs, poy anhkei ej oloklhroy sto Dhmosio. Oson afora ta metra asfaleias, thn armodiothta exoyn oi arxes asfaleias.

IWANNOY: Me poianoy thn ypodeijh egine h diarryqmish; Me toy ypoyrgeioy Dikaiosynhs;

PRWTOPAPAS: Gia ta metra asfaleias einai armodies oi arxes asfaleias kai oxi h kybernhsh. Apo ekei kai pera, ean to dikasthrio apofasisei allws, exei dikaiwma, opws exei se ola ta qemata pleon, ton apofasistiko kai mono logo, na kanei tis opoies allages. Apo tis 9 to prwi, olh h eyqynh diejagwghs ths dikhs kai ola ta diadikastika qemata poy syndeontai me th dikh, anhkoyn sth dikaiodosia toy dikasthrioy. Epomenws, den mporw na sas apanthsw, dioti den eimai ypeyqynos. Gia ta qemata poy exoyme thn eyqynh emeis, ta opoia einai ektos ths aiqoysas toy dikasthrioy, eyxaristws na bohqhsw oso mporw. Gnwrizete, hdh, tis dhlwseis poy exw kanei thn Pempth kai kyriws thn Paraskeyh, sxetika me to magnhtofwno, to opoio kai epetraph. Ayto egine kai se synennohsh me thn ESHEA kai ton k. Sompolo proswpika, dioti to eixe zhthsei me idiaiterh entash. Qeloyme na bohqhsoyme toys dhmosiografoys, gi@ ayto exoyme apodexqei, edw kai tesseris hmeres, to sxetiko aithma ths ESHEA kai kanoyme o,ti einai dynato gia na sas dieykolynoyme, opws qa to kanoyme kai me to aithma poy exei ekfrastei gia ta thlefwna. Exw zhthsei apo thn ka Sphliopoyloy, poy exei thn eyqynh, na to kanei apodekto. Dhladh, na ejetasoyme texnika th dynatothta metaforas twn kartothlefwnwn sthn aiqoysa Typoy. To ejetazoyme qetika, pantote bebaia me thn airesh twn texnikwn dynatothtwn. O,ti mporei na kanei to Ypoyrgeio Typoy & MME gia na sas dieykolynei to exei kanei kai qa synexisei na to kanei. Mh me rwtate, loipon, tipota gia thn aiqoysa toy dikasthrioy.

IWANNOY: To qema ths diarryqmishs den einai qema toy dikasthrioy. H "QEMIS" kataskeyastikh apofasise pws qa ginei h diarryqmish;

PRWTOPAPAS: H diarryqmish egine apo th "QEMIS" kataskeyastikh. Epeidh, omws, exete arxisei kai rwtate leptomereies, qa moy epitrecete na pw oti aytes einai aney oysias. Qa me anagkasete na kanw pali mia politikh dhlwsh, analogh ekeinhs toy Sabbatoy, gia na strafoyme sto kyrio zhthma poy einai h oysia ths dikhs. H aiqoysa anhkei stis fylakes. Bebaiws, egine prospaqeia diarryqmishs gia na ejyphrethsei tis anagkes ths dikhs. Katalabainete oti, gia logoys asfaleias, kai s@ ayth th dikh yparxoyn qemata ycisths asfaleias. Den jekinhsame na ftiajoyme ena eidiko ktirio apo thn arxh. Eprepe h aiqoysa na brisketai sto xwro poy einai oi kathgoroymenoi, gia logoys poy den xreiazetai na sas analysw. H aiqoysa, loipon, ej antikeimenoy, den htan kataskeyasmenh gi@ ayto to skopo. Egine poly kalh kai filotimh prospaqeia apo toys armodioys ths "QEMIS" kataskeyastikhs gia na dhmioyrghsoyn toys oroys ths kalyterhs diejagwghs ths dikhs. Kai omologw oti oi anqrwpoi exoyn ergastei oso mporoysan kalytera. As mh syzhtame, loipon, diadikastika qemata. Ayta einai kala, gia na ginetai ena eidos "elafras" syzhthshs sta kanalia, alla nomizw oti o ellhnikos laos alla perimenei.

IWANNOY: Oloi oi kathgoroymenoi zhthsan na fygei ayto to koyboyklio. Den to zhtame emeis. Ti ejyphretei;

PRWTOPAPAS: Oi kathgoroymenoi mporoyn na zhthsoyn o,ti qeloyn. Einai mesa sta dikaiwmata toys. Fantazomai oti qa qesoyn qema kai gia thn armodiothta toy dikasthrioy, opws lene -to akoysa ayto- kaqws kai gia to qema twn enorkwn, twn armodiothtwn kai mia seira allwn qematwn. Dikaiwma toys einai. Einai mesa stis dynatothtes poy dinontai apo th dikonomia. Alla, h kybernhsh den mporei na gnwrizei ti qa ginei. Apo th stigmh poy arxizei h dikh (giati akoysa kai mia kyria se ena thleoptiko staqmo poy profanws den gnwrize tis synqhkes ths dikonomias kai elege, giati bgalate ejw toys fwtografoys) mono to dikasthrio mporei na apofasisei gia otidhpote exei na kanei me thn aiqoysa. Gia ta qemata ths thleoptikhs kai radiofwnikhs metadoshs, twn enstasewn, toy alejisfairoy kai diafanoys koyboyklioy, ths xwrotajias ths aiqoysas, twn kinhtwn sthn aiqoysa kai otidhpote allo syndeetai me thn aiqoysa kai th diejagwgh ths dikhs, h kybernhsh den exei kamia armodiothta. H armodiothta anhkei sto dikasthrio. Apo ekei kai pera, eimaste se synexh syzhthsh me thn ESHEA kai opoiadhpote allh dhmosiografikh organwsh gia na dieykolynoyme toys dhmosiografoys, xwris omws na exoyme armodiothta gia thn aiqoysa toy dikasthrioy.

MIXAHL: Afoy, loipon, to dikasthrio exei thn eyqynh ths aiqoysas, giati espeyse apo prin to ypoyrgeio Dikaiosynhs na th diarryqmisei kai den perimene h na synennohqei me to dikasthrio kai na paroysiasei eggrafa...

PRWTOPAPAS: Sas parakalw, qa hqela na milame sobara. Katalabate ti eipate;

MIXAHL: Nai, poly kala. Giati to ypoyrgeio Dikaiosynhs espeyse na kaqorisei th xwrotajia ths aiqoysas me bash ta dika toy krithria, afoy to dikasthrio einai ayto poy qa apofasisei gia thn eyryqmh leitoyrgia olhs ths diadikasias apo twra kai sto ejhs;

PRWTOPAPAS: Qelw na sas qymisw oti to dikasthrio sygkrothqhke kai leitoyrghse apo shmera to prwi. Fantasteite an h aiqoysa htan giapi ti qa eixe ginei. Ayto me rwthsate twra. Giati den perimename prwta na sygkrothqei to dikasthrio kai meta na kanoyme thn aiqoysa.

MIXAHL: Eseis mporei na th xarakthrisete opws qelete thn erwthsh, alla egw qa epimeinw. Poios htan o kratikos leitoyrgos poy ekrine oti qa eprepe na mpei ayto to gyalino alejisfairo kloybi gyrw apo toys kathgoroymenoys; Kai deyteron, ti stigmh kata thn opoia oi arxes asfaleias ypedeijan sygkekrimenoys elegxoys gia na yparxei to aparaithto epipedo asfaleias, giati yparxei to gyalino kloybi; Mhpws den exoyn empistosynh sta metra poy ypedeijan;

PRWTOPAPAS: O,ti eixa na pw to exw pei. Profanws, yphrxan protaseis twn arxwn asfaleias kai oxi ths kybernhshs, gyrw apo thn asfaleia twn kathgoroymenwn. An to dikasthrio qewrei kai einai sth diakritikh toy eyxereia oti h asfaleia twn kathgoroymenwn einai apolytws eggyhmenh kai alliws, to dikasthrio qa prajei alliws. Den yparxei kanena problhma. Einai protimotero -an qelete- kapoia arxh asfaleias na epidiwjei perissotera metra kai na erqei to dikasthrio na afairesei merika ap@ ayta, para na ginei to antiqeto. Dioti, qa kathgoroysame tis arxes asfaleias an ta metra poy eixan labei htan ligotera apo o,ti eprepe. An qewrhsei to dikasthrio oti ta metra einai perissotera ap@ o,ti xreiazetai kai afairesei ena-dyo ap@ ayta, poio einai to problhma; Den yparxei problhma. Einai protimotero na frontizoyn oi arxes asfaleias gia to epipleon, para gia to elasson. Exoyn akoystei arketes anohsies aytes tis hmeres. Gia paradeigma, shmera to prwi, bghke kapoios kai elege oti moiazei kai me to Synedrio toy PASOK. Qa hqela na parakalesw na ginei katanohto oti to kyrio zhthma olhs ayths ths diadikasias einai h oysia ayths ths dikhs. To eipa to Sabbato, to eipe kai o k. Xrysoxoidhs xqes. Qa me anagkasete na sas to epanalabw. Einai mia poly shmantikh stigmh gia th xwra kai thn koinwnia mas. Meta apo 30 xronia poy katatalaipwrhqhke o ellhnikos laos kai h xwra apo th drash ths tromokratikhs organwshs ths 17N, kathgoroymenoi gia th symmetoxh stis drasthriothtes kai tis aparadektes energeies ayths ths organwshs, odhgoyntai se mia dikaih dikh. Einai poly shmantiko na parakoloyqhsoyme th diejagwgh ayths ths dikhs kai me thn telikh apofash toy dikasthrioy, to opoio qa krinei apolytws anephreasta kai afoy prwta diejaxqei omala h akroamatikh diadikasia, na mporesoyme na maqoyme poioi telika eyqynontai gia thn kaqe energeia, wste na epelqei h kaqarsh se ena qema poy talanise thn ellhnikh koinwnia tosa xronia. Einai ena poly megalo zhthma poy afora oloys mas kai prepei na to proseggisoyme me eyqynh, sobarothta kai xamhloys tonoys.

Qa parakaloysa, loipon, na stamathsei h diadikastikologia. To dikasthrio einai, pleon, armodio gia ta panta. Emeis kanoyme o,ti mporoyme gia na sas dieykolynoyme. Mhn epixeiroyme, loipon, na dhmioyrgoyme problhmata ekei poy den yparxoyn.

I. KAMPOYRAKHS: Qa hqela na rwthsw dyo pragmata: Prwton, pws sxoliazei h kybernhsh to gegonos oti oi kathgoroymenoi den hqelan na fwtografhqoyn mesa se ayto to gyalino kloybi kai den einai diadikastikh h erwthsh....

PRWTOPAPAS: Den mporw na sxoliasw ti kanei o kaqe kathgoroymenos, einai dikaiwma toy.

I. KAMPOYRAKHS: Milhsate prohgoymenws gia thn oysia ths dikhs...

PRWTOPAPAS: Gia thn oysia omilw.

I. KAMPOYRAKHS: To klima ayths ths dikhs einai oysia kai ti prospaqei na kanei o kaqenas, mesa apo ayth th dikh, kai ayto einai oysia. Einai politiko qema.

PRWTOPAPAS: Oxi, den einai kaqoloy politiko, ean oi kathgoroymenoi qeloyn na fwtografhqoyn h oxi. Ayto einai dikaiwma toys kai to dikasthrio ekrine. Den mporw na krinw tis apofaseis toy dikasthrioy. To Ypoyrgeio Typoy kai MME frontise na diapisteysei peripoy 30 fwtoreporter, eite apo tis efhmerides, eite apo kanalia, eite apo ta Praktoreia, eite apo thn Enwsh Fwtoreporter k.o.k. Eixan parei diapisteyseis polloi anqrwpoi, gia na mporoyn na kanoyn th doyleia toys. Apo kei kai pera, ean to dikasthrio krinei alliws, den mporw na kanw tipota. Etsi einai ta pragmata.

I. KAMPOYRAKHS: Den htan diadikastikh h erwthsh ki eseis mphkate sth diadikasia. Egw ennooysa, ean ayth h kinhsh exei kapoia politikh oysia h kapoia oysia gia th diejagwgh ths dikhs.

PRWTOPAPAS: Den mporw na to krinw kai katalabainete giati. Giati den mporw na mpw se enan periergo dialogo metajy Kybernhtikoy Ekproswpoy kai eite kathgoroymenwn, eite dikhgorwn, eite dikasthrioy, eite eisaggelea, eite martyrwn. Ayto qa htan laqos mas. H kybernhsh den mporei na parembainei sth dikh, opws to idio prepei na kanoyn kai ta politika kommata, kata th gnwmh moy. Twra, ean prokycei ena meizon qema, qa to doyme, alla den prepei na parembainoyme. Prepei na afhsoyme anephreastoys toys kyrioys dikastes. Prepei na sebomaste to ycisto leitoyrghma poy ekteloyn, prokeimenoy na mporoyn na aponeimoyn dikaiosynh.

TRIANTAFYLLOY: Synadelfoi poy breqhkan shmera to prwi sto dikasthrio, lene oti den einai mono oti den exoyn optikh epafh me toys kathgoroymenoys, giati einai pisw apo to koyboyklio oi dhmosiografoi, den exoyn omws kai hxhtikh epafh. To mono dhladh poy fqanei se aytoys einai ta osa leei o Proedros toy dikasthrioy. Ayto, kata th gnwmh sas, den exei kamia shmasia gia thn oysia ths ypoqeshs;

PRWTOPAPAS: Apo o,ti plhroforhqhka, sthn aiqoysa Typoy akoygontai ola. An yparxoyn texnika problhmata, qa frontisoyme na diorqwqoyn. Ola ta qemata poy syndeontai me thn omalh diejagwgh ths dikhs mesa sthn aiqoysa toy dikasthrioy, ta lynei to dikasthrio. Emeis ti mporoysame na kanoyme; Mporoysame, gia paradeigma, na dhmioyrghsoyme to Kentro Typoy me ton tropo poy dhmioyrghqhke kai einai o kalyteros dynatos, me bash tis texnikes dynatothtes poy yphrxan. Deyteron, mas zhthsate apomagnhtofwnhmena keimena. To dexqhkame kai malista merimnhsame na yparxei etaireia, h opoia qa dinei ta apomagnhtofwnhmena keimena, se synennohsh me thn Enwsh Idiokthtwn Hmerhsiwn Efhmeridwn Aqhnwn kai qa ta lambanete oloi. Sth synexeia, mas zhthqhke na epitrapoyn ta dhmosiografika magnhtofwna. To dexqhkame. Mas zhthse shmera to prwi o k. Sompolos na ejetasoyme th metafora twn kartothlefwnwn. Edwsa entolh sth Genikh Grammatea Enhmerwshs toy ypoyrgeioy Typoy Dhmhtra Sphliopoyloy na ejetasei texnika to aithma ths ESHEA, me kateyqynsh na to ikanopoihsei, oso ginetai. O,ti mporoyme na kanoyme ektos aiqoyshs dikasthrioy, eimaste anoiktoi. Qelw na to jekaqarisw. Alla, ektos aiqoyshs. Den mporoyme entos aiqoyshs.

GIANNISHS: Sto xwro eyqynhs sas, poy einai h aiqoysa Typoy, den leitoyrgoyn ta thlefwna, oi thlefwnikes grammes poy exoyn topoqethqei.

PRWTOPAPAS: Pws einai dynaton na mh leitoyrgoyn; Mhpws ennoeite ta kinhta;

GIANNISHS: To thlefwniko kentro poy exei topoqethqei den mporei na antapokriqei...

PRWTOPAPAS: Oi thlefwnikes grammes den exoyn topoqethqei sto Kentro Typoy. Ayto fantazomai oti to gnwrizete. Oi thlefwnikes grammes einai sth diplanh aiqoysa.

GIANNISHS: Gi` ayth thn aiqoysa milame.

PRWTOPAPAS: Zhthse to prwi o k. Sompolos na metaferqoyn ta kartothlefwna sthn aiqoysa Typoy kai edwsa entolh na ejetastei to aithma ths ESHEA qetika, ypo thn texnikh ennoia, ean ginetai dhladh na to pragmatopoihsoyme. Akoysa to prwi para polloys synadelfoys sas -etyxe na briskomai se enan thleoptiko staqmo- kai moy ekane foberh entypwsh kai ekei katerreysan ola ayta poy akoygontai. Ebgaine o synadelfos sas -ean qelete na sas pw kai to onoma, erxetai syxna sthn politikh enhmerwsh- apo mesa, me to kinhto toy, elege oti einai sto Kentro Typoy kai metedide plhrofories poy eblepe sto monitor h sto ``videowall''. Poy shmainei, praktika, oti eixe th dynatothta kai akoygotan kai o hxos kai eipe oti gia na mhn kanei radiofwnikh metadosh kai paranomhsei, to kleinei. Etsi eipe sto staqmo, afoy metedwse prwta ayto poy hqele na metadwsei. Exoyme ayto to paradeigma kai mh moy peite oti den egine. Ayto deixnei oti ta pragmata den einai opws ta paroysiazoyme, einai poly kalytera kai poly eykoloterh h pragmatopoihsh toy ergoy sas. En pash periptwsei, prwth hmera einai, piqanon na paroysiasthkan kai texnika problhmata, poy den eixame problecei. Ekeino poy qelw na sas diabebaiwsw einai pws opoiodhpote texniko problhma mas gnwstopoihsete, qa kanoyme ta adynata dynata gia na to diorqwsoyme. Den mporw na problecw thn emfanish olwn twn texnikwn problhmatwn. O,ti omws mas lete, o,ti kataqetei h ESHEA, o,ti mas zhtate, exw dwsei pagia entolh sthn ka Sphliopoyloy kai stis yphresies toy ypoyrgeioy na prospaqoyn na to ikanopoihsoyn, ektos aiqoyshs pantote.

SOYGLERHS: Yparxei kati poy anhsyxei thn kybernhsh, pera apo ayta poy lete, poy na leitoyrghsei arnhtika gia na milame gia mia dikaih dikh meta apo pente mhnes poy qa ekdoqoyn oi opoies apofaseis;

PRWTOPAPAS: H kybernhsh den anhsyxei gia kati. Exei plhrh empistosynh sto dikasthrio. Qa einai mia dikaih dikh kai oi apofaseis qa ekdoqoyn, otan oloklhrwqei h akroamatikh diadikasia. Den exoyme kanena logo na anhsyxoyme kai kanena logo na problhmatizomaste.

ELENOPOYLOS: Sthn arxh eixame ton kainoyrgio nomo me ton opoio shmera oi kathgoroymenoi, ws melh ths 17N, proshxqhsan sth dikaiosynh. Ayto einai to prwto. Meta eixame to nomo poy aforoyse th radiothleoptikh kalych, to nomo poy eixe ferei to ypoyrgeio Dikaiosynhs. Kai sth synexeia aytwn eixame mia seira zhthmata, ta opoia fqasame na koitame ws shmera. Rwtw, loipon, poly apla, giati, afoy thn oysia qa th diapragmateyqei to dikasthrio, o aplos poliths den mporei na exei plhrh eikona. Qelw na eimai safhs: Den bazw th lejh entos eisagwgikwn. Thn plhrh eikona.

PRWTOPAPAS: Pali ta idia.

ELENOPOYLOS: Exontas ypoch oti h thleorash kai to radiofwno einai Mesa Typoy, alla eidikoy kaqestwtos, afoy ypokeintai ston elegxo toy kratoys, symfwna me to nomo, h Politeia exei th qesh kai thn pepoiqhsh oti den prepei na yparjei ``sooy'', dekto, ara, loipon, kanones ep` aytoy...

PRWTOPAPAS: Ti einai ayta poy lete; H Politeia qa pei, otan o nomos problepei kati allo;

ELENOPOYLOS: Ma to nomo eseis ton chfisate.

PRWTOPAPAS: Xairomai giati to qymhqhkate meta apo eji mhnes.

ELENOPOYLOS: Qelete na ryqmisete na mh ginei sooy. Ayto, to xeirokrotw apo toys prwtoys. Apo kei kai pera, omws, as moy peite sto radiofwno, sthn thleorash, oxi panw apo deka lepta... Na to dexqw kai ayto.

PRWTOPAPAS: Koyrazeste xwris logo kai synomiloyme pali peri ``onoy skias''. Dioti: Prwton, exei ejasfalistei, opws fanhke kai mexri twra, h plhrhs dhmosiothta ths dikhs kai h enhmerwsh toy ellhnikoy laoy. Egw apo to prwi, oso prolaba bebaiws, sto plaisio toy ergoy poy yparxei edw, prospaqoysa na enhmerwnomai kai sas plhroforw oti enhmerwnomoyn mia xara apo tis thleoraseis gia to ti ginetai sth dikh. Ara, yparxei plhrhs enhmerwsh. Deyteron, o nomos den proekyce apo monos toy. Gia to nomo ayto yphrjan kat` arxhn oi akrothtes toy kalokairioy kai yphrje aithma ths Enwshs Dikastwn kai Eisaggelewn, poy mas eipan -kai nomizw oti to lene kai dhmosia- oti den mporoyn katw apo orismenes proypoqeseis, poy en pash periptwsei tis exw xarakthrisei kai den xreiazetai na epanelqw, na aponeimoyn swsta th dikaiosynh. Ara gia logoys orqhs aponomhs ths dikaiosynhs, h Politeia chfise ena nomo. Den einai tyxaio oti sth sxetikh diatajh yphrje eyrytath pleiochfia. Kai eipame, apo kei kai pera, oti kat` arxhn apagoreyetai. Bebaiws, to dikasthrio mporei na ektimhsei, me symfwnh gnwmh twn diadikwn, na brei lyseis h ean yparxoyn logoi dhmosioy symferontos. Giati h ryqmish poy kaname, den egine gia th dikh ths 17N, einai gia oles tis poinikes dikes. Ara, loipon, as perimenoyme to dikasthrio. Ayth h syzhthsh parelkei kai den exei kanena oysiastiko periexomeno.

Me thn eykairia blepw kapoioys kyrioys, oi opoioi gyrizoyn kai lene, giati to ypoyrgeio Typoy xarakthrizei th dikh ``poinikh''. Dioti einai poinikh. Den jerw ean to gnwrizoyn. Mporei merikoi na mhn to jeroyn. Qa toys bohqhsoyme, loipon, na to maqoyn. Ginetai me th diadikasia ths poinikhs dikhs, dioti ayto problepetai apo to nomo.

ELENOPOYLOS: Tote giati den exei laikoys dikastes;

PRWTOPAPAS: Dioti problepetai apo to nomo. Kai apo th stigmh poy problepetai apo to nomo einai logiko to ypoyrgeio Typoy na qewrei aparaithth th diapisteysh gia thn parakoloyqhsh poinikhs dikhs, poy shmainei oti einai epibeblhmenh h thrhsh toy nomoy. An kapoios kathgoroymenos qelhsei na kataqesei enstash sto dikasthrio h na milhsei gia antisyntagmatikothta toy nomoy, ayto den qa to krinoyme emeis, qa to krinei to dikasthrio. Kai oyte emeis mporoyme na topoqethqoyme. Ayto poy ginetai mexri twra kai ayto poy efarmozoyme ginetai me thn aysthrh thrhsh toy nomoy. Den to kanoyme ayqaireta.

ELENOPOYLOS: Me sygxwreite, den kanoyme erwthmata gia ton Typo kai gia to ypotiqemeno qema@

PRWTOPAPAS: Sas eipa oti egw to prwi enhmerwqhka plhrws.

ELENOPOYLOS: Oxi, egw den enhmerwqhka kaqoloy kala, gi` ayto epimenw.

PRWTOPAPAS: Eimai bebaios oti enhmerwqhkate.

ELENOPOYLOS: Egw exw staqei sthn oysia ths dikhs. Logw dhmosiografikhs empeirias, qa breqoyme pro ekplhjewn, gi` ayto epimenw. Lew, loipon, qymhqeite oti to swoy to opoio prohghqhke, prin h dikh ftasei sto akroathrio, egine me eyqynh kapoiwn. Kapoioi edinan plhrofories@

PRWTOPAPAS: Swsto.

ELENOPOYLOS: @prwton ayto. Kai deyteron, qymhqeite oti shmera sthrizete tis apanthseis sas se ena qesmiko plaisio, to opoio eseis ferate sth Boylh. Epomenws@

PRWTOPAPAS: To aitiologhsa plhrws. Emena, jerete, den moy aresei na to paizw Pontios Pilatos, pote. Den eipa oti einai nomos kai oxyrwnomai apo pisw toy. Aitiologhsa kai giati katateqhke o nomos. Qa prosejate oti den yioqethsa kapoia apoch poy elege na poyme oti yparxei o nomos kai na mhn poyme tipota allo. Oydepote xeiristhka etsi ta qemata. Mphka sthn oysia kai ejhghsa se oloys -kai idiaitera diejodika to exw ejhghsei- giati ftasame sto na eishghqoyme ayth th diatajh, giati h Boylh thn apodexqhke kai giati yphrje ayjhmenh, poly ayjhmenh pleiochfia kata thn yioqethsh kai chfish ayths ths diatajhs apo th Boylh. Afoy, loipon, to exw ejhghsei epaneilhmmena kai apo th stigmh poy perimenoyme oytws h allws to dikasthrio na parei tis telikes apofaseis toy, dioti hdh exei teqei qema, opws jerete, tote ti logo exei o ypoyrgos; Qa apofasisei to dikasthrio kai o,ti pei. An oi kyrioi dikastes aisqanontai oti mporoyn na aponeimoyn dikaiosynh kata ton a@ h b@ tropo, na eiste bebaioi oti pros ayth thn kateyqynsh qa paroyn tis apofaseis toys. Einai qema dynatothtas toy dikasthrioy na diejagei swsta th dikh, na aisqanqei, kata ton kalytero tropo, wste na krinei mia idiaitera sobarh apofash. Mporei na steilei enan anqrwpo, eite spiti toy, eite isobia kai na aponeimei dikaiosynh. Ayth einai h pragmatikh ennoia aytoy toy erwthmatos.

ELENOPOYLOS: H genikh ektimhsh poy epikratoyse sthn kybernhsh, meta th syllhch twn melwn ths "17N", htan oti h tromokratia sto basiko ths pyrhna kai en pash periptwsei sta dyo dynamika zhthmata, exei ejarqrwqei. Rwtw, loipon, poia einai h (den akoygetai) enos neoy qesmikoy antitromokratikoy plaisioy, poly perissotero, afoy apodeixqhke apotelesmatiko, opws isxyristhke h idia h kybernhsh. Kai ena deytero stoixeio, to opoio afora th morfh ths dikhs, thn oysia ths dikhs: Ean dexqoyme ws isxyra ta osa mexri shmera exoyn dhlwsei stelexh ths kybernhshs, metajy twn opoiwn kai synarmodioi epi toy qematos, oti h tromokratia dexqhke isxyrotato plhgma kai htthqhke, tote giati h dikh den einai politikh kai einai aplws poinikh;

PRWTOPAPAS: An kai pali qa eprepe na sas pw na perimenoyme thn apofash toy dikasthrioy, epeidh einai ena genikotero qema, qa sas pw mia ektimhsh poy exoyme. Den einai dikh politikh h dikh anqrwpwn poy ebazan bombes kai skotwnan aqwoys, katapatoysan kaqe ennoia anqrwpinhs ajioprepeias kai sebasmoy ths atomikhs proswpikothtas, tromokratoysan, lhsteyan trapezes. Opws exw tonisei edw kai polloys mhnes, oi anqrwpoi aytoi ekanan egklhmata. Kata synepeia, einai logiko na dikazontai me th morfh poinikhs dikhs. Qa apodeixqei poioi einai enoxoi, bebaiws. Egw den mporw na jerw poioi einai akribws enoxoi, oyte mporw na gnwrizw me ti egklhmata mporei na barynetai kaqenas. Ayto qa to krinei to dikasthrio. Alla, to olo plaisio ths dikhs, einai logiko kai proypoqetei na yparxei poinikh dikh. Einai mia dikh gia egklhmata. Apo ekei kai pera, katalabainete para poly kala, oti to qema ths tromokratias sthn Ellada exei ypostei mia idiaitera baria htta, toso me th syllhch kai ejarqrwsh ths tromokratikhs organwshs "17N", oso kai me thn poreia ejarqrwshs kai twn allwn tromokratikwn organwsewn. Gnwrizete hdh oti brisketai stis fylakes h hgesia ths h toylaxiston aytoi poy ferontai ws hgesia -gia na mhn protrejw- ths tromokratikhs organwshs ELA. Kai bebaiws einai sto plaisio twn kaqhkontwn mas, sthn kateyqynsh mas, sthn prospaqeia mas h syllhch kai ejarqrwsh kai twn allwn tromokratikwn organwsewn poy kata kairoys edrasan sthn Ellada. Epomenws, meta to peras kai aytoy toy kykloy qa mporoyme na exoyme to symperasma oti h Ellada einai mia apo tis pio asfaleis xwres ths Eyrwphs. Prospaqeia mas, omws, den htan mono na ejarqrwsoyme aytes tis tromokratikes organwseis. Prospaqeia mas htan na katapolemhsoyme genikotera to fainomeno ths tromokratias kai na apomyqopoihsoyme thn tromokratia sthn Ellada. Gia to skopo ayto, qa elega, oti kataballoyme mia idiaitera sobarh prospaqeia sto politiko pedio, na antimetwpisoyme me tis arxes ths dhmokratias, me thn yperoxh ths dhmokratias ta fainomena kai tis katastaseis poy dhmioyrghse h tromokratia. Gi` ayto, ejalloy, odhghsame toys kathgoroymenoys, me plhrh sebasmo twn dikaiwmatwn toys, se mia dikaih dikh. Einai logiko, na frontizei o nomoqeths, einai logiko na frontizoyme se kaqe qesmiko plaisio poy etoimazoyme tis anagkaies prosarmoges, wste pote sto mellon na mhn yparjei periptwsh na emfanistoyn h na epibiwsoyn kai pali tromokratikes organwseis sthn Ellada. Bebaiws, ayto den exei na kanei me to orato mellon. Omws, qa elega, oti einai logiko, kaqe fora lambanontas ypoch ta fainomena poy yparxoyn pagkosmiws, lambanontas ypoch th dieqnopoihsh toy fainomenoy, qa mporoyme na kanoyme beltiwseis, prosarmoges sto qesmiko plaisio. Pistecte me, se kamia periptwsh gia anairesh dhmokratikwn dikaiwmatwn twn politwn kai ths eleyqerias ths ekfrashs. Makria apo mas tetoies logikes, alla se sxesh me ta poinika zhthmata poy exoyn na kanoyn me th syllhch kai parapomph se dikh twn tromokratwn. Yparxoyn zhthmata poy mporei na syndeontai me thn paragrafh h otidhpote allo kai ta opoia exoyme, kata kairoys, syzhthsei. Na to jekaqarisoyme ayto. Pote den prokeitai, oso einai ayth h kybernhsh sthn Ellada, na chfisei ena qesmiko plaisio, to opoio na dhmioyrgei problhmata sta dhmokratika dikaiwmata twn politwn kai sthn eleyqeria ths ekfrashs.

KARGOYDH: Yparxei shmera dhmosieymenh mia nea dhmoskophsh poy ayjanei th diafora eis baros toy kybernwntos kommatos me th Nea Dhmokratia stis 7,5 monades kai anadeiknyei ton k. Karamanlh, ws katallhlotero gia Prwqypoyrgo. Dhladh, einai mia dysmenesterh gia thn kybernhsh apo thn prohgoymenh dhmoskophsh. Qelw to sxolio sas.

PRWTOPAPAS: Apo edw kai pera, fantazomai kai olo ayto to ejamhno poy dianyoyme, opws synhqws symbainei, qa yparjoyn para polles metrhseis kai para polles dhmoskophseis. Den einai dynaton kaqe fora na antimetwpizoyme thn kaqe metrhsh h thn kaqe dhmoskophsh ws koryfaio politiko gegonos. Alla einai ta koryfaia politika gegonota. Ayto ton kairo exoyme para polla mprosta mas. Kaqe metrhsh kai kaqe dhmoskophsh exei th dikh ths ajia. Oydeis to amfisbhtei. Einai ergaleio analyshs. Exoyme safws topoqethqei gi` ayto. Apo thn allh pleyra, omws, oi dhmoskophseis den chfizoyn, odhgoyn se symperasmata. Ekeinos poy chfizei einai o ellhnikos laos, o opoios qa chfisei kai to ergo poy qa exoyme kanei kai thn antapokrish mas sta problhmata toy, alla kai tis prooptikes, tis opoies sth synexeia qa xarassoyme. Ayta einai poy qa metrhsoyn sto telos. To ergo mas kai oi prooptikes gia thn parapera poreia mas, sta opoia kai strefoyme to endiaferon mas.

KEDIKOGLOY: Dhmosieyetai oti einai mia krisimh ebdomada ayth gia to Kypriako. Qa hqela ena sxolio sas gia osa eipe o k. Erntogan sth synenteyjh toy kai sygkekrimena sto shmeio poy anaferei oti epiqymei mia lysh me bash amoibaio symbibasmo sto Kypriako kai oramatizetai thn Toyrkia, thn Ellada kai thn enwmenh Kypro, ws melh ths E.E., shmeiwnontas oti qewrei thn Ellada mellontiko strathgiko etairo. Poio einai to sxolio sas;

PRWTOPAPAS: Eimaste oi teleytaioi poy qa exoyme antirrhsh gi` ayto. Kai emeis, opws gnwrizete, qeloyme to dialogo, sxeseis kalhs geitonias kai synergasias. Exoyme parembei kai qa synexisoyme na parembainoyme yper ths eyrwpaikhs poreias ths Toyrkias kai qeloyme th symbolh ths gia thn epilysh toy politikoy problhmatos ths Kyproy. Ekeino poy qelw na tonisw einai oti qa prepei na yparxei -kai ws genikh diapistwsh to lew- synepeia logwn kai ergwn. Dhladh, oxi mono na diapistwnoyme ayta ta zhthmata, alla empraktws sta megala qemata na to apodeiknyoyme. Kai to lew ayto gia thn toyrkikh pleyra. Na apodeiknyei o,ti pisteyei kai empraktws kai na ylopoiei aytes tis diakhryjeis. Dioti mexri stigmhs, mas exoyn dhmioyrghqei ki emas erwthmatika.

KEDIKOGLOY: Gnwrizw oti den qelete na sxoliazete apofaseis jenwn Koinoboyliwn, alla epeidh afora ena pagkosmio problhma, ton polemo sto Irak, h apofash toy toyrkikoy koinoboylioy na mhn egkrinei to amerikaniko aithma syndromhs, pisteyete oti dinei perissotera periqwria sthn ellhnikh Proedria na mesolabhsei gia thn apotroph toy polemoy;

PRWTOPAPAS: As mhn to doyme, omws, etsi. H apofash toy toyrkikoy Koinoboylioy afora thn Toyrkia. Qa elega, oti h apofash ayth einai poly shmantikh kai prepei na problhmatisei polloys. Den qa hqela na thn krinw parapera. Apo ekei kai pera, h ellhnikh Proedria qa synexisei na parembainei gia thn ejeyresh eirhnikh lyshs sto meizon qema ths krishs toy Irak kai se kaqe periptwsh na epimenei oti oi opoies apofaseis kai oi opoies ejelijeis prepei na ginontai panta mesa sto plaisio toy OHE.

POYLIDOY: Mia dieykrinish: Stis 10 Martioy exei kalesei o k. Anan se ranteboy ton k. Papadopoylo kai ton k. Ntenktas. Apo thn ellhnikh kybernhsh poios qa parastei sthn ypografh toy dhmochfismatos; Gnwrizete;

PRWTOPAPAS: Apo o,ti jerw mexri twra den exei kaqoristei. Qa yparjei omws ekproswpos, se politiko epipedo.

IWANNOY: Qelw na rwthsw kati sxetiko pali me th dikh. Akoysame to prwi arketoys synadelfoys na anarwtioyntai, giati to PASOK telika apofasise na mhn parastei sth dikh gia th bomba poy eixe topoqethqei ejw apo ta Grafeia ths Xarilaoy Trikoyph. Mporeite na mas peite gia poio logo, telika, apofasisate etsi;

PRWTOPAPAS: O k. Aqanasakhs einai o katallhloteros gia na apanthsei se ayto. En pash periptwsei, qa ton rwthsw gia na sas dieykolynw.


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